Are Labradoodles and Cockapoos Simply Mutts?
It has been a while since there has been any controversy on this blog. However, an article from a recent issue of Veterinary Economics may stir things up.
The terms of use of the hosting website prohibit me from both linking to the article and quoting directly from it. Please click on the link to see what the author (Melody Heath, DVM) has to say in her own words.
But, to paraphrase, here is her thesis. Shih Poos, Schnoodles, Labradoodles, Cockapoos and other dogs that are descended from two parents of different breeds are mutts. People who buy them are being ripped off. They are buying mixed-breed dogs (that always seem to be half Poodle) at purebred prices.
And she goes a step further. She claims that it is unethical to purchase a mixed-breed dog. Why pay $1500 for a mixed-breed dog when so many other mutts are languishing in shelters and facing euthanasia for lack of a home?
Do I agree? Partly. By definition, any dog that is not purebred is a mutt. So Dr. Heath is definitely right on that score. However, first generation mutts benefit from a phenomenon known as hybrid vigor. The principle of hybrid vigor states that the direct progeny of two inbred (read: purebred) parents will, on average, be heartier and more robust than either parent.
So, although Cocker Spaniels are prone to chronic ear infections and Poodles suffer disproportionately from heart disease, a first generation Cockapoo is less likely to develop either problem than his parents. And, his personality may be predictable–much like a purebred dog. Every Cockapoo I’ve met has been a really great dog.
Sadly, the benefits of hybrid vigor (and the predictable nature of personalities) dissipate in subsequent generations. Most geneticists would agree that if two Labradoodles mate their progeny will, definitively, be mutts.
What about the ethics of purchasing a “designer mutt” when shelter dogs are in need of homes? From the shelter dog’s point of view, the pedigree of the dog you purchase is irrelevant. If you want to save a shelter dog, don’t pay a breeder for any type of dog. Go to the pound.
Like any good argument, I can see a bit of logic to both sides of this one. I welcome your retorts and input in the comments section.
You have questions. 
I agree with “don’t pay a breeder for any type of dog”.
There is NO need to purchase a dog for any reason, what with shelter dog’s demise.
I could care less if he is purebred, cockadoodle-mutt, mixed breed, or a winning show dog…there is no justification of purchasing a dog while shelter dogs die.
None.
But isn’t this how all “purebreed” dogs got their start? Combining two different dogs to hopefully achieve the desired traits?
First off I would like to say, that these dogs are NOT hybrids. A hybrid is a mix of two species, not two different dog breeds. These dogs are mutts. And usually ugly ones too. We have enough evil Pomeranians, Poodles, and Malteses. I’m so sick of hearing about these dumb “designer” dogs. And to any one who has been ripped-off, and bought one of these mutts, I hope you’re happy. Five shelter dogs die every time you buy a dog from a petstore, or worse one of these backyard breeders. Every single one of these mutt breeders is a backyard breeder, ever notice that?
I have a “designer” dog that I wouldn’t trade for the world. And he is not ugly. Yes, I bought him from a breeder that was probably considered a backyard breeder. I do not consider myself as having been “ripped off” either. I also bought three purebred puppies from breeders - good responsible breeders. And yes they are AKC registered. They are also spayed and neutered. There are certainly area’s in this country that have shelters that have lots of dogs needing good homes. In my area however, there are very few small dogs available to adopt and that is what I wanted and felt suited my lifestyle the best. I looked and looked and couldn’t find a small dog in my area. Most of the rescues I found would not adopt outside a 200 mile radius which still left me unable to find the dog I wanted. So what option is there but to purchase a dog? I cannot see how that is wrong IF you are buying from a responsible breeder that is careful to make sure their puppies are healthy and carry on the best traits of their breed. I probably would not actively seek out another “designer” dog now that I am more aware of backyard breeders, but I am NOT sorry I gave him a wonderful home. He is healthy, happy and well loved and has the best care I can give him. You can call him a mutt if you wish - I don’t think he cares.
I have to whole heatredly disagree with Lisa.
While buying from a shelter is admirable and good, there are some instances where it’s best for someone to get a dog from a breeder. Most shelter dogs come from bad breeders, puppy mills, and private owners who probably bought the dog from a bad breeder. Since bad breeders (and puppy mills) don’t care/know that they need to help keep the breed healthy, the dogs from shelters are GENERALLY less healthy than dogs from good breeders who do all the health testing (including the OFA and CERF tests).
Not only that, but we need good breeders to keep the breeds healthy and as according to standard as possible. How can they do that unless some people buy from them??? Without good breeders, because of the breed’s health not being protected, the health of the dog breeds would go very low and consequently more dogs would end up being dumped in shelters.
P.S.
Good breeders try to keep the breeds as close to standard as possible because without a standard to go by the breed’s looks, personality, and temperament would vary much more and as a result it’s much harder for people to find the breed that fits their lifestyle the best.
I support reputable breeders, shelters, and rescue 100%.
I hate how people are constantly bashing all breeders, instead of just the bad ones.
cookiemiller.tripod.com
I love my GoldenDoodle !!! And would not trade him for the world. He is great, all around. The Belle of the ball where ever he goes. He is great with kids and in ALL situations I have put him in. I have never known a dog like him. I never regret a dime - or choice I made in having him. I do not use the term Designer - as he is not a wallet or a handbag and quite frankly I take offense to it.
And a mutt is 3 or more breeds. A Cross is 2 breeds mixed. A hybrid can be found when you breed two different species of bovine or plant but not a dog??? Still do not understand that….
I myself have volunteered hundreds of hours to the Humane Society and Animal Hospital. I have seen both sides. BUT what most people don’t realize that people who get a GoldenDoodle are not looking at shelter dogs… No offense I support shelters 100%. But We are not sentencing shelter dogs to death -0- Bad Breeders and irresponsible owners did that!!
We are not taking away homes from the shelter/rescue dogs “could” have had. I love the fact that there are so many different breeds for homes. A Dane is perfect for one while a Terrier is a perfect fit for another.
Where a GoldenDoodle is the perfect fit in ours!
I have no problems with designer breeds, but refering to the rules about what a good breeder does as I stated above, there are VERY few good breeders who breed mixed breeds.
You can usually find designer breeds at a shelter (we’ve had Cockapoos and the like in our local shelter), rescue group, or through private owners in the local paper, so if I wanted a designer breed I would go to those sources.
I also don’t have a problem with people starting new breeds. In fact, I wish that they would the way they are ruining breeds like the German Shepherd these day by trying to change the looks yet still call it a German Shepherd. Why can’t they make the sloped-backed Shepherds in a new breed? (The sloped back is NOT in the GSD breed standard at all!) They could call it the Slope-back Shepherd.
P.P.S
Sorry, off topic, but:
And before someone comes on here saying that shelter dogs make better pets than breeder dog and all that blah-blah-blah, I’m telling you, it’s simply not true. I have had dogs from breeders and from the shelter, and let me tell you, in my experience dogs from the shelter make just a good pets as dogs from breeders. In my experience, they also love you just as much, though they seem to appreciate you more.
I agree the GSD is definately being bred for looks - really deep slope - can’t be healthy as you probally know more about it than me. And its Okay to spend $2500+ on a bulldog when they proven time and again 2 be the most ill bred Purebred.
And I do have a problem with designer breeds…It is when people are breeding ANYTHING to ANYTHING without cause or reason except to have the next trend or for profit.
And you do find Purebreds in shelters to, more often than most think. I have seen them come in with their AKC papers (which doesn’t say much anymore). Anyone can register a litter of AKC puppies - as long as both parents are. Doesn’t matter is both parents have HD or any other prone illness to a specific breed.
When the AKC starts tightening reg. then I will have some repect for an AKC dog. Maybe if they allow reg. after 2 year and only after Pennhip/OFA & CERF approved.
.. Just a thought that will probally never happen. Just think how much money the AKC makes each year in all the reg. litters. Anyway We all have the right to choose and know what is right for our family. And if someone wants to spend the money who are we to say they can’t?
All we can do is educate. Instead of saying do NOT buy one educate on the right precautions and “How” to find a reputable breeder - not support a BYB or Puppymill .
I agree. Education is key.
I think that if people want one of these mixed breed dogs and want to pay the premium price, it’s their choice. Every dog needs a good home whether it comes from a breeder or a shelter.
I agree 100% River… An AKC registration means next-to-NOTHING anymore in my opinion. Anybody can register a dog regardless of health or conformation as long as the parents were registered. I volunteer for a Lab rescue (unfortunately, the number 1 AKC breed for a number of years) and let me tell you that we pull dozens of dogs each year from our local shelter that are purebreds not to mention the 150 or so that are owner surrenders. In fact, I think at least 50% of the dogs that I see in shelters are purebreds. People walk by the puppy store and say “oh gee, look how cute! Let’s buy a puppy!” and then once the pup grows up and isn’t so “cute” anymore, or they have a baby that leaves them no time to care for it - they dump it at the shelter. I own a pet supply store and I see many of the so-called designer breeds every day and and I hear on a regular basis that the Goldendoodles and Labradoodles have severe food and inhalant allergies, not to mention the typical Lab and Golden problems of bad knees and bad hips.
Yes, all current breeds were established by cross-breeding - but they were bred for a JOB, not for their looks - which means that they had to be healthy. Now it is all about looks, which means that idiot breeders and puppy-millers can get away with selling Silver Labs (no such thing technically) for thousands when all it really is is a poorly bred chocolate that is most likely a genetic nightmare. But these breeders count on the fact that we fall in love with our pets and would never give them up or trade them for another. It makes it easy to offer “guarantees”. Shameful. Save your cash and go to the shelter or a rescue. Bet you can find plenty of “designer breeds” there.
What does it matter where a dog comes from, if it has been loved and cared for and continues to be loved and cared for? All animals deserve a nice home, whether from a breeder or not. Why do we have to be so polarized? My mum and dad got dogs and cats from breeders, they were good people all, not greedy, very caring, and the animals were happy and healthy. A rescue pet is not for everyone. I have a rescue cat, and yes I’m glad to do my bit, but I’m not going to take the moral high ground about it. Animals of ALL backgrounds need love.
The physcical problems with a labra or a goldendood is the same as a purebred Golden or lab - both genetic makeups between a Standard Poodle and a Golden Retriever. — BUT the genetic problems when bred together do supply a HYBRID vigor. BUT as stated earlier if bred responsibly and in the 1st generation which is AKA F1. There are very few breeders who do it for the passion of the “breed” standard/health vs the $$$. There is a HUGE market for a very well loved and tempered - HEALTHY - Cross. Only problem is they do NOT require papers so BYB find it a fast easy $$ .
I think these GoldenDoodles are the best thing since…well I just think they are a great family pet - demeanor - size - devotion. And YES they are just adoodleable!
Now GoldenDoodles ARE bred for a job- alot go as therapy dogs, to homes with allergies, and service dogs. There are alot of ill bred ones - but that goes for any breed of dog. You may not consider a GoldenDoodle a breed, But tell that to someone who has one and is their beloved companion.
“Guarantees” in any breed are “shameful” . I do not care if you have a Purebred/mutt/cross/hybrid anything - if you are a dog lover and have an animal in your life for a few years….No one is going to “trade” them in. You are better off having a Guarantee that takes your final amount you pay to go towards your vet bill. Now that is a Guarantee worth something. But how many breeders will actually commit to it if the need arrises?
Anyways all I know is no dog is fool proof - all come with health risks - no matter HOW well bred or ILL bred.
I have a designer dog, yes it is called a hybrid, and no they are NOT mutts
read the definition of Mutt
“A mixed-breed dog (also called a mutt, mongrel, tyke, cur, or random-bred dog) is a dog that has characteristics of two or more types of breeds, or is a descendant of feral or pariah dog populations. The term crossbreed refers to puppies produced by the breeding technique of breeding known dogs of two different purebred dog breeds for some specific reason. The term “mutt” generally refers to a dog of unknown descent. Dogs interbreed freely, except where extreme variations in size exist, so mixed-breed dogs vary in size, shape, and color, making them hard to classify physically.”
this is NOT a hybrid or a designer. Designer dogs are only breed through purebred parents. not one designer with another designer.. only then are they mutts. a designer dog uses 2 and no more then 2 different KNOWN PURE breeds. and those pups are not to be bred. its common sense! and for those who are downing the designer dogs, where do you think the BOSTON TERR came from? its a cross breed of the bull dog and the now non existant english terrier, and was first called a “bull terrier” until later was called the boston terrier. So most dogs esp the small ones were all mix breed dogs. They are NOT mutts. They are a new breed. as long as thier parents are pure breed.
i myself have a BUGG, boston terrier/pug and she is the best of both dogs and will not be prone to all the health conditions of either breeds.
as far as the selter well thats not for everyone, speaking first hand, you are gambling with a shelter dog because you dont know thier tempermant nor what they have been through. one simple thing can make them snap, i have seen it many times. though i never will say to not get a shelter dog, just make sure you are right and have the patients to work with an adult dog that has been through alot.
I think it’s kind of sad to see so many dog lovers beat each other up over these kinds of differences of opinion. In a world where so many dogs are neglected, abused, and abandoned, we’re directing our anger at the wrong people by flaming other posters on sites like this one.
I have no issue with animal lovers who have a special fondness for a certain breed, and I don’t think they should be expected to compensate for the sins of all the irresponsible people who have abandoned their dogs to the streets or shelters. As to whether they’re wasting their money on a crossbred dog, I guess it’s their perogative to spend their money any way they want.
But I do think a lot of people have huge misperceptions about mutts, and that they get expensive purebred dogs for the wrong reasons. Often they pick a breed based on appearance, with very little education about the breed’s traits or unique challenges. And they assume that the dogs at the shelter (or the “oopsie” puppies at the neighbor’s house), must be inferior pets because they don’t cost $1200.
I have a scruffy little terrier mix, and people are constantly stopping me on the street to ask what “kind” he is. Most are surprised when I tell them he’s no particular “kind,” and that he was a stray from a shelter.
For most of us who are just looking for a faithful and affectionate family member, there are plenty of shelter dogs out there to fit the bill. It might take some time to find the right dog, rather than getting the instant gratification of going out and buying one. But buyer’s remorse is a reason why so many dogs (purebred, “hybird,” and otherwise) end up in shelters, so it’s not such a bad idea to take your time choosing.
Actually, Goldendoodles can make people allergic. A Golden is not hyopallergenic, while a Poodle is. So, there’s a 50/50 chance whether the puppies between a Poodle and a Golden will be hyopallergenic or not.
Oh no, I think that all dogs are great. There is no inferior breed or mixed breed.
I currently have a mixed breed from the shelter, and a purebred from a breeder. Both equally great pets, wonderful companions, and willing to please.
My past dog was from a breeder as well. He was a little miniature Poodle we named “Rascal”. Cute little guy. He always obeyed very promptly and eagerly. He cost about $200.
To tell you the truth, when people makes comments like Lisa’s above, it burns me up and makes me want to get all of my future dogs from breeders. A selfish emotion, I must admit. I have a quick temper and when it’s flared I tend to be contrary.
But, if you really want to know, some of my future dogs will come from breeders, some from shelters, and some from rescues.
I am currently studying to one day become a responsible breeder so I can help keep the dog breeds healthy also.
Actually some goldendoodles are hypoallergenic - but you cannot guarnatee all. I had a lady who is allergic come to my house…
Get licked by my golden retriever on one arm and insantly a red sore… THEN when Chewy Licked her other arm not a reaction- and played with him all day with no reaction. I was unaware there was such a thing as allergic to the saliva of a dog.
I had another instance were a boy at age 9 came to my house to meet Chewy, and when Chewy came running up to him the kid was deathly afraid of him by fear of an outbreak. I guess he swells up and all. BUT Chewy was fine with the boy and even licked him in the face and drooled on him. It was beautiful to see a boy be able to have a puppy that never before even considered it… So this is not always the case but I found it very interesting.
River,
In regards to this statement:
“And a mutt is 3 or more breeds. A Cross is 2 breeds mixed. ”
I disagree. What is your source for this? Did you decide this, or would you told this by your dog’s breeder?
A mutt is a dog that is not a purebred. Period. Saying you don’t want to call your dog a “designer dog” but that he is rather a “cross” is simply a matter of semantics. “Hybrid”, “designer dog” or “cross breed,” are all just different terms to refer to mutts that have been bred for profit.
I am not chiming in my opinion on the morality of breeding mixed breed dogs, but I will say that we would all do well to “call a spade a spade.” If you want to buy a “designer dog,” that’s fine, but let’s call it like it is.
I fondly call any non-purebred dog a mutt. The main problem I have with “designer breeds” is that they are bred for MONEY, not for the love of the dogs. People who are breeding “for pets” and pet quality animals are disregarding that even champions throw pet-quality dogs. I understand loving a breed and seeking out a responsible breeder. I also understand loving the secondhand dogs so much that you hate to see a trend like designer puppies threaten potential homes for shelter dogs.
Apparently, the term “hybrid” is also used in plants, even when it’s the same species; however, many dog owners think of dog hybrids as dogs that are part wolf, for example.
I love my mutts, but don’t think they should be bred. I cringe at breeders’ claims that their cross-breds or designer dogs or whatever they call them will be flawless - this is not true. Often, two low-quality dogs - say a low-quality Pug and a low-quality Beagle - will be bred to make a litter of poor-quality puppies. By quality I’m talking about adherence to the breed standard, NOT how good they are as pets. Of course any dog can be a great pet. Of course all dogs need love. But no dog should be used solely to make money, especially if deceit is involved.
Nena, you said it all!
To everyone out there Goldendoodles ARE great pets and would not hesitate to refer one to anyone looking for a loving healthy family pet (but obviously a reputable one) ! Everyone that meets one loves them! Speaking of it… Its about time I hugged my designer/mutt/hybrid/ CHEWY right now!
Nena I wish you had an open mind worth educating, but I feel it would get lost in a “set” frame. Your mind is set and not open to debate. Love your mutts and give them a smooch from us!
Whenever I see one of these “designer dog” discussion, the lack of knowledge regarding breeding and dog genetics on both sides of the argument simply blows my mind.
My favorite argument from people who are for designer dogs is that “this is how all breeds got started.” This argument simply does not hold water because the majority of breeds in existence did not get started by crossing two breeds of dog. One, because it’s assuming that there were already established breeds in existence. And two, because the majority of breeds got started when people began to selectively breed dogs for the traits they wanted to see - usually traits that served a purpose.
Example - the German Shepherd Dog was created in the late 19th Century from existing herding dog stock (which was locally bred based on its abilities) to create a working breed dog that would have certain characteristics. This is called selective breeding.
Simply putting a male Poodle and a female Bichon together is NOT selective breeding as it does not breed for a purpose (beyond making money, anyway) and it does not breed for specific traits.
The second argument that does not hold water is the argument that mixed breed dogs are somehow superior because they are not inbred, because of hybrid vigor, because they will have certain traits, etc.
Anyone who knows the first thing about genetics knows that this argument does not work. Any pup, whether it is from a mixed or purebred litter, has a chance of inheriting genetic conditions and inheriting either traits from either parents. It’s a crap shoot - you can not know what you get until you get it. Particularly in the case of many backyard breeders who don’t do any type of testing for health and genetics, it’s even more of a crap shoot.
Breeders can not guarantee that a dog will be “non-shedding” and “hypo-allergenic” simply because it is mixed with Poodle. There are oodles of Labradoodles out there who do shed and who are not hypo allergenic. Why? Because each puppy inherits genes from both parents - so each puppy stands an equal chance of inheriting the Lab coat and traits or the Poodle coat and traits.
I have absolutely zero problems with mixed-breed dogs. All dogs are lovely and there are great mixed breed dogs and great purebred dogs in the world. Either kind can do wonderful things and excel in training and dog sports.
What I have a problem with are bad breeders of either kind, purebred and mixed breed. First, because they are putting pups into the world from dams and sires that should have never been bred, due to lack of health and temperament, lack of genetic testing before breeding, and simply lack of knowledge before breeding. There are just way too many people doing it WRONG.
The problem with creating “designer breeds” is that about 98% of all breeders producing these dogs are not responsible breeders - they do not title their dogs in anything, they do not work their dogs in anything, they do not do any health testing, or any of the things that a responsible breeder does. Then they market their product as the latest and greatest (and, most important, “UNIQUE”) so that people can feel special when they shell out thousands for their dogs.
No, these dogs are not purebred, and NO, THIS IS NOT how purebreds got started. And think about it. Purebred dogs don’t have stupid names that are just combining two breeds together. Most have respectable breed names. No poos or oodles.
Purebred dogs got the rep of being ‘unhealthy’ because of irresponsible backyard breeders who have never even heard of OFA or CERF, and don’t care about the health of the breed, they just want to sell puppies.
There is absolutely NO REASON for these designer dogs to be bred. They have no pupose, and are just a fad. The “labradoodle” was a failed experiment. They do shed. There are tons of dog breeds already that don’t shed. That’s a poor reason to breed a dog.
If you have one of these dogs, I’m sure you love it, but at least don’t be stupid and go around bragging about how it’s a rare “breed” or how much you paid for it. Call it by it’s mix of its breeds, get it neutered, and take care of your dog.
AbbyK9 said it very well. We have a Mastiff/Rott mix that has had Arthritis and allergies from about the age of 3 and spinal problems for the last few years. We have 2 Bulldogs that have thier yearly check ups and don’t have any health issues. Yes all dogs need to be loved and we all have different opionions of what our perfect dog is but these people that breed the designer dogs are just out for the money, nothing else and that in itself is very scary. If you think by buying a cross breed dog your not going to have health issues, they aren’t going to shed or they are somehow superior to purebreds you better do your homework because it just isn’t true.
What I can’t figure out is why “responsible breeders” or supporters of feel the need to argue with anyone who are all for shelters and rescues. They may not agree with you or understand how you feel, but there’s definitely nothing wrong with just leaving it at that. Let them get their pets from a shelter or rescue and continue to encourage others to do so as well. There will always be enough people who don’t give a crap and buy animals from breeders & pet shops.
It just seems those who support the “responsible breeding” thing get SO defensive. If you’re a responsible breeder and you are doing nothing wrong, you shouldn’t even feel the need to have to defend yourself, the proper people will still come to you because you are respected.
I know I’m ranting here. I do see both sides to the story. I’m not saying I agree or disagree. Maybe I feel like arguing that responsible breeding is ok is just leading some people to believe that going to any breeder is ok because they won’t listen to your whole story, just what they want to hear.
I’m tired. I also realize someone is really going to find something wrong with my response.
I wish more people weren’t so picky on what type of dog they wanted or what characteristics they want their pets to have. Its not acceptable in society to do that to children, I don’t find it acceptable for animals either, but I know I’m a bit singled out there.
Should you pay for a mixed breed? Well I don’t really see why you should unless it’s a rescue or shelter fee. But any pet I have had in my life have turned out to be worth a million bucks. Mixed or not.
When my AKC Schnauzer passed away of old age, my adult son and I attempted to adopt a shelter dog. We live in upstate NY. Not only are shelter dogs $150.00 to “adopt” but we were turned down to adopt one because we both work (even though I am able top come home for lunch). So, my son went on the internet looking for a dog and found two adorable Puggles (cross between a Pug and a Beagle), who needed to be rescued. They had been abused and abandoned as very young puppies, taken in by a Maltese breeder who looked for a good home for the brothers. The breeder was located in Kentucky. We paid $500.00 for the vet check and shots, and to have them flown to NY. My boys are now 3 years old. They’re adorable..not ugly by any means. They suffer from emotional problems due to their early abuse, but are otherwise fine and we love them both so very much.
I can appreciate why shelters charge money to adopt and why they go through a lengthy invetsigation process of perspective dog owners, but by rejecting us because we worked kept a shelter dog from getting a very loving home.
Yeah I was rejected by a rescue because I didn’t have a 6 foot tall non chain length fence. :( But I suppose if those were that adorable sweet little old dog’s needs I couldn’t meet them.
Now Abby K-9 said it best.
Tarka, I found nothing wrong with your post.
I don’t know where everyone gets their information but here goes: If you know BOTH parents of offspring dogs they are called AMerican Dogs NOT Designer dogs or oodles of anykind. If you know Only ONE of the parents they are called MUTTS. a HYBRID IS dog that has at least 1/4 wolf. Back yard breeders are only in it for the money because a TRUE Breeder rarely ever makes money, just ask anyone that is affiliated with AKC. The true breeder only does it because they are trying their best to keep a particular breed the way that breed was intended to be. It makes no difference where you get your pet, the main concern should be that you treat it as humanly possible.
Ok, so by that reasoning, I’m assuming you didn’t have children because there are so many unwanted children in the world.
Surely you adopted one of them, right?
The argument about dogs is just as silly. I have purchased dogs from pet stores. They need rescuing a lot more than some shelter dogs. Those dogs have been born, have not been cared for, and I’m supposed to let them die because a puppy mill created them? No - enforce the laws about puppy mills and put them out of business. Don’t blame the dogs they create.
I end up spending a fortune on veterinary care to care for these poor dogs. I’ve also adopted from shelters and had much healthier dogs because the shelter took care of any initial problems. Every one of my dogs appreciated it.
I don’t know where you get your information about the terminology used, Pat, but it is not correct.
Puppies resulting in the mating of a male of one breed and a female of another breed are mixed-breed puppies, regardless of whether both parents are known or not. Mutt and mongrel are simply different terms for “mixed breeds”.
“Designer dog” is what people call them if they want to charge huge sums of money for them, but they’re still mixed-breed puppies. The term designer attempts to imply that they were “created” by human “design” and that they are special or unique. (You know, like designer handbags or designer shoes. It’s a way of adding a bigger price tag onto a cheap product.)
The term HYBRID is generally used for the interbreeding of two different species, such as dog x wolf (giving you a wolfdog or wolf hybrid), or donkey x horse (giving you a mule). For some reason, the “designer dog” crowd has latched onto the term - probably because it sounds exotic and special. But it is used wrongly if used for breeding two of the same species (dog).
“I don’t know where everyone gets their information”
Where do you gets yours?
“It makes no difference where you get your pet, the main concern should be that you treat it as humanly possible.”
Actually it does. Sometimes by purchasing a dog you are doing more harm than good in the long run.
Say, you get a dog from the pet store. Sure, it saves that dog, but another dog will come to take it’s place and that dog will suffer.
Say you buy from a backyard breeder, which treats the dogs well and probably even provides good vet care, but they don’t do health testing. By buying from that kind of breeder, you are contributing to the unhealthiness of the breed. In other words, while that puppy from the BYB needs no rescuing, by buying it, you are making dogs suffer because supporting a breeder who doesn’t health test keeps the breed from being healthy.
“The argument about dogs is just as silly. I have purchased dogs from pet stores. They need rescuing a lot more than some shelter dogs. Those dogs have been born, have not been cared for, and I’m supposed to let them die because a puppy mill created them? No - enforce the laws about puppy mills and put them out of business. Don’t blame the dogs they create.”
Ir’s great that you are so compassionatte, but buying from a pet store only saves that dog and makes others have to suffer. The more people who refuse to buy from pet stores, the easier it will be to stop puppy mills.
Yes, I feel very sorry for the pet store dogs, but I’d rather save a bunch of lives than just one that will make MORE have to suffer because of being bought.
I currently own a Goldendoodle, Dandi. For the past 32 years I have had AKC registered dogs, some healthy, good dogs, some not healthy, I have owned shelter dogs, again some good, healthy dogs and some unhealthy with really aggresive temperments. I have bought from breeders, shelters and pet stores. I have been blessed with some really great dogs, no matter what their breed. We bought our Dandi in “hopes” of having less hair since we have allergies. We knew, since out breeder informed us, that not all goldendoodles shed less hair, but we bought her anyway. Dandi is the most loving, giving, intelligent, sweet dog that we have ever had and she is worth every dime we spent to get her and she sheds very, very little and only when we brush her. Our breeder (even though she breeds dogs in her home) is very upfront with her clients about what to expect from her dogs. She owns both father and mother of her puppies. She works hard to get each and every one of her pups into good, loving homes. I would go back and purchase another dog from her any time. She is no puppy mill. She takes better care of her dogs and puppies than any other breeder, shelter or pet shop that we have seen.
I’m rambling, but some of you have made statements that folks who breed these types of dogs are only in it for the money. I think it’s a shame to make statements about people that you don’t know. I think it’s great to adopt shelter dogs, AKC registered dogs, or even the ooops dogs down the street, since all dogs deserve to be loved and cared for. I think it’s great that there are so many different kinds of dogs since there are so many different kinds of people. Your dog may be “right” for you but not right for your neighbor, we need to have an open mind and not be so judgmental and prejudiced about what others find to be “right” for them.
Sorry about my ramblings, but I forgot to tell you, if you want to call Dandi a mutt, go ahead, it dosn’t bother either of us. In fact I’m a mutt too. Not pure Irish, English or German. Funny thing is no matter where we go EVERYONE falls in love with her, even folks who have purebred dogs and folks who don’t like animals fall in love with Dandi. Everyone has opinions on what is right for them and we need to respect those opinions even if we disagree.
I always say very few breeders who breed mixed breeds are ethical. I know of a great Collie breeder who breeds mixed breeds sometimes. It’s not so bad if they do all the necessary health testing and all. Sounds like Dandi’s breeder is at least half-way decent.
“She takes better care of her dogs and puppies than any other breeder, shelter or pet shop that we have seen.”
That may be, but most of us here don’t think much of pet shops at all, so that part of the argument is moot.
Who says that we hate mixed breeds!?!?!?!?! NOBODY said that.
I have one mixed breed right now, and I like mixed breeds as much as any purebred. I love every single dog I see.
I too am a mutt. I have French, Irish, Scottish, German, English, Spanish, Cherokee Indian, and who knows what else in me.
Every loves my mutt too. I’m training him out of his behavior problems and by October he should be a Canine Good Citizen, he’s learning so fast. I cannot say he is the best dog I ever had because I feel that he’s just as good as any dog I ever had.
“Everyone has opinions on what is right for them and we need to respect those opinions even if we disagree.”
Exactly.
I don’t care for pet shop either, and I never accused anyone of hating mix breeds. Some of the statements (not yours) have sounded like if you didn’t go a shelter or a rescue facility then shame on you. Some stated that no one should ever buy a dog that’s not from a shelter. I have had folks tell me that because I had pets that I was doing the “wrong” thing since all the money could go to a starving child, but they didn’t find anything wrong with them taking a nice long vacation that cost 10 times what I pay to have my pet for a whole year! That’s amazing to me and very judgemental.
Cookie TN it’s great to hear that your dog is getting their Canine Good Citizen award, that shows how much you work with you dog. We are in the process as well.
This is a off the subjet, but I just love Dogster. We can come together just as folks who love their dogs no matter what they are. And it’s o.k. to agree to disagree!
“I have had folks tell me that because I had pets that I was doing the “wrong” thing since all the money could go to a starving child, but they didn’t find anything wrong with them taking a nice long vacation that cost 10 times what I pay to have my pet for a whole year!”
That sounds like in WW II (or was it WW I?) where some people were killing their dogs because they took up food and money that could be used for the soldiers, but they completely forgot that war dogs were helping them win the war.
I’ve had people tell me that my dog from a breeder didn’t deserve a home as much as my shelter dog. Uh, no all dogs deserve homes equally. Now, some need homes more than others, but that’s beside the point.
Sorry for being a bit rude.
My goodness this topic makes me so happy! I’m SO glad to see that someone agrees wit hme that these “breeds” are nothing more than mutts. I work at a vet where we are constantly seeing these rediculous “breeds” that i refuse to even name, it’s a mix is what it is. And I think its rediculous that people pay the amount of money they do for a mutt. It’s very true that people should go to a shelter and adopt a mix that otherwise wouldnt stand much of a chance, but these “breeders” pass off what I’m sure are accidental puppies as breeds. As long as the mother was one breed, and the father was another, its a mutt. In many many years when a dogs great great grandparent dogs were cockapoos or labradoodles or whatever rediculous name, then maybe I will consider it a real breed. But untill then…
WOW, I’m sure glad my vet’s office dosen’t treat Dandi or I with such an attitude! They all come running to love up on her the minute she walks through the door. Breeds that you refuse to name? I’ve gotta be honest that sounds very harsh. I don’t know anyone who owns a goldendoodle, labradoodle or any other kind of “doodle” who thinks or says that their dogs are purebred. We all know that our dogs are mix breeds or mutts if you prefer. I’m glad that they treat Dandi just like all the others who come through the door…with love and compasion.
As far as “but these “breeders” pass off what I’m sure are accidental puppies as breeds. As long as the mother was one breed, and the father was another, its a mutt.” If you do some research you will find that most breeders of “doodles” own both mother and father or at very lest know who they are breeding too, and it was no accident that they bred. There are always people out there looking to make a fast buck, ones that don’t care about the animal, ones who should NEVER be allowed to own an animal, but that is not the standing rule for breders of doodles in out area. Just like there are good people willing to love any dog…shelter, rescue, breeder, the mutt and the purebred, then there are people who seem to think only THEIR way is best. Only buy a shelter or rescue dog ,only by purebred, only buy a German Shepherd and so on. Sadly these people try to tell others that only what they think and so is right and they miss out on a lot of good experiences because we don’t fit their mold. I can only hope that these folks don’t judge people with the harshness that they judge dogs and dog owners.
In regards to Ashley’s comment, if you can’t love all manner of animals equally, you have no business working in a vet’s office, in my opinion of course.
I am a vet tech and we have close to 3,000 clients at our small practice and while I do know all of the regulars by name (their furry babes as well!) my favorite dog above all others is a goldendoodle named Raleigh. She is the sweetest thing and when she’s coming in we all look forward to it all day! When she’s boarding she spends all of her time with me, at my feet, instead of in a cage. She is gorgeous, has an amazing temperament and lives to make you happy. How can there be any controversy over an animal this wonderful?
I also am fortunate enough to know two GIGANTIC labradoodles named Terra and Zusa and though they very rarely board I enjoy them almost as much as Raleigh! (I mean I can’t very well pick them up and cuddle them!)
My point is, why do you care where people get these dogs and what you call them? Every puppy needs a home, whether it be from a breeder (responsible or otherwise) or a shelter, whether its a “pure bred” or a “mutt”. If everyone stopped buying from breeders, breeders wouldn’t be able to breed anymore and believe it or not dog breeds would eventually become extinct! It sounds crazy but its true. Eventually these “purebred” dogs would cease to exist.
People will bring a dog into their life the way that it makes sense for them to do so. Who are we to judge how that is if they are loving and caring for their pet?
“My point is, why do you care where people get these dogs and what you call them? Every puppy needs a home, whether it be from a breeder (responsible or otherwise) or a shelter, whether its a “pure bred” or a “mutt”.”
I know that you weren’t talking to me, but it while every dog does need a home by buying from some places you are contributing to bad things and helping that bad thing to stay around. I have no problem with good breeders, just bad ones like BYBs, puppy mills, and pet shops (which get their dogs from puppy mills).
I care very much where people get their dog because I want to help stop the “breeders” who breed out of greed and the puppy mills who overbreed and neglect their dogs just to get money.
There are other ways to put bad breeders out of business, but every little bit helps and refusing to buy from a bad breeder is one way to help.
Amanda C. you sound like my Vet & her staff, they all try and be the one who gets Dandi whenever she comes in. The ladies in the business office even come out to pet and love on her. Raleigh sounds like my Dandi. Thanks for being a loving hand to all who cross your path!
Cookie TN, you have an amazing heart, I can almost hear it breaking when you speak of puppy mills and such. My heart is right there with you and it would be great to shut down bad breeders, puppy mills, but most of all, every bad animal owner who does not take care of their pets. These people purchase animals, even expensive pure breeds and then don’t take care of them. The shelters are full of animals that someone purchased (even from good breeders). If everyone only bought from the shelter there would still be dogs and other animals neglected and let to run the roads. People forget or maybe don’t realize how much work, time and money it takes to take good care of their pets. It’s very sad and I applaud your heart for these animals. We have had amazing dogs that came from our local shelter. However, when we went to buy a dog we had something specific and we found that in Dandi. Keep loving and caring, your dogs and or pets are very lucky to have you as their owners.
Thank you. I have always been way into dogs and their welfare even when I was 5 years old. I wanted to breed dogs when I was about 10 or 11, but luckily for me since I was too young to do it yet, I did the next best thing to actually breeding: study about breeding dogs. I found out a lot of things and I felt that breeding was for me because I’d just love to be able to help keep the dog breeds healthy. I made that my biggest area of knowledge in dogs because I want to help make a difference by telling people about breeders and possibly even breeding dogs someday (after a lot more research and some experience with a good mentor, which I haven’t been able to find yet). Even if I never get to breed dogs, I can at least make a difference by telling people what I know about it.
Wow! A VET’S HONEST OPINION!! THANK YOU!!!
I 100% agree with you! if you want a purebred…then pay the purebred fee and get the freakin’ papers!! But if you want a lovable mutt…Be it a Labradoodle, a yorkiepoo, a cockapoo, a shihtzu-mix or labmix pup…then SAVE A LIFE!! You’re going to pay an outrageous price at a breeder for something you can find at a local shelter for a fraction of the price??? And that lovable mutt at the shelter is in danger of losing his life! While there aren’t enough foster homes to care for all of them! I bet you’d be mad if you discovered you were ripped off at a local auto dealer! These are hard times we’re living in and we have to invest our money wisely…This includes our furry friends…
i have a purebred bichon frise and a mutt. no offense to my bella (bichon) but she was probabaly a puppymill dog. and dixie (my mutt) is a blue heeler mix. dixie is so much smarter and socialized and healthier than bella. at the dog park, people always tell me how beautiful dixie is and they want to know what breed she is. i also work at a boarding facility. i love our mutts. granted, there are a few crazy ones…but our purebreds are unsocialized and they dont play well with the other dogs. our malitpoos and cockapoos and our goldendooldes happen to be very good dogs and i choose to call them mutts and i say it in a very positive, unashamed way.
I bought a mutt from a person, not a breeder, and payed 300 dollars. I find that no one gives away puppies for free like kittens!
Eitherway, I did go to a shelter and stuff but the shelters charge you 400 dollars for a dog under a years, that hasn’t even been fixed. Sooo, thats why I didn’t buy from a rescue or a shelter, because they charge way too much.
Kat, the shelter in my area only charged $85.
Nothing wrong with buying from an individual.
So here is my two cents on this issue… I have three beloved babies: Mia - a “rescue” from a local shelter “a mutt” - the best darn dog you could ever get - an all around good girl. Great temperment - barks alot but hey, I can live with it. Second there is Ginger - my Pom poo princess, paid 800 for her - she is worth every penny! The best of both breeds cute, pompous, little, gives Mia a run for her money. She is the princess as I said. Then there is Lily - we loved Ginger so much we got another PomPoo 750 for her! She is the happiest go lucky dog you’ll ever meet! She is the sunshine of the house. The baby, spoiled rotten! The cat’s best friend. Mia’s crime partner. The sock stealer, the jokester. My sons’ playmate, Ginger’s nudge!
Lily also has had to have surgery on her hind legs for genetic hip issues, she will develop arthritis early in life. I am angry about this. But I am happy that she is mine because I know that I will do everything in my power to make sure she has all the best medical care she will ever needed. She will not be returned to a shelter because of her expensive medical care. She is my responsibility. My child. We are committed to her for a lifetime.
So you see the point isn’t designer dog, hybrid, mutt, shelter dog, store bought dog, found dog, gift, or whatever…
When you become a dog owner you are responsible for another life. And that is a commitment that should last a lifetime - it should be a forever thing. What your dog is and how you got it shouldn’t matter what should matter is the love and care you provide and the promise you make to that living creature to never turn your back on it no matter what. - I know that in the future there will be room im our life to add to our family. How the new members will arrive I do not know - but I do know that when they arrive the commitment will be one of forever.
All true, Kat, my point is just that there are some places that should never be supported. At all.
Don’t get me wrong, one of my current dogs and the dog I had before were both from bad breeders. Cookie actually belonged to two bad breeders. The one her previous owners bought her from and her previous owners wanted to breed her. That was before I was educated about breeders, or I would have protested getting them. They were both wonderful dogs. I don’t regret owning them. They’re both GREAT dogs that I’m proud of. I just regret supporting, even in part, the so-called breeders they were from. But, I wouldn’t give up either of my current dogs or my other dog from the past if I still had him for the world.